El Chisme

“As usual, leftists are championing a doomed cause” kids are literally getting mass murdered you fucking stupid piece of shit. What the absolute fuck is wrong with liberals?

As usual, leftists have championed a doomed cause

Algeria: Liberated.
Vietnam: Liberated.
India: Liberated.
Zimbabwe: Liberated.
South Africa: Liberated.
Ethiopia: Liberated.
Burkina Faso: Liberated.
Mexico: Liberated.
Cuba: Liberated.
Countless other former colonies: Liberated, liberated, liberated.

But Contrapoints has said Palestine will never be free, so

There's something just so vile about this sort of "Optics liberalism" where it's more important to get "people" on "your side" than it is to actually stand for anything. That being inane and inoffensive is more important than actually making a difference. This idea that actually wanting to do something about a problem is just as bad as the problem itself, this insistence on tiny, incremental steps towards "change" instead of actually doing something about a problem. The sheer spinelessness of it all, while acting like she is "brave" for going against leftist opinion about Palestine and being pro"a bit less genocide, as long as we say Hamas is just as bad." something that might've flown 2-3 years ago, but Israel is far too mask off now, even most libs recognise it. No wonder Hillary Clinton is her best friend, they're both just as tone deaf as each other.

amazing things are happening on r/Contrapoints (tweet)

Breadtube was a mistake

the liberal has no beliefs. She believes in nothing other than aligning with what she perceives is the socially acceptable left-liberal position. It should have been obvious she no longer had a soul when she was willingly hanging out with Hillary Clinton. Contrapoints is not a person with beliefs other than she deserves an audience. She's an empty vessel, she's a husk who wants attention. She wants a personal mythology and adoring fans. Everything she says is run through a filter to calculate the best possible audience retention. This is a person for whom beliefs and internal conviction are not an avenue to change the world, but rather beliefs are a malleable problem to be solved by choosing the correct postures in order to gain some mythical mainstream appeal.

The liberal is someone who believes there is a correct position, not necessarily correct on its own merits or based upon personal experience, but instead it's correct by virtue of how much of an audience it can get. But it's not even properly calibrated, it's based on the perception of what a broad liberal audience may agree with. Like I'm reminded of how Chuck Schumer has an imaginary retired couple who lives in Long Island or something, and before he does anything, he considers what their opinion might be. Liberals have given themselves imaginary brain creatures who whisper in their ears on what to say and do, because they know if they only acted based on conviction, if they only said words based on their own beliefs, the only words out of their mouths would be "i want to be popular."

contrapoints strikes me as the kind of person who would say "free Palestine.... from Hamas "

Didn’t read her liberal zio drivel. It thought I’d check the comments… why did I look at the comments… I was hoping some would be dragging her but it’s all just total parasocial sycophancy

LMAO

The online left has been posting photographic evidence of deliberate and continued atrocities

People are getting mad at the people committing and defending these atrocities

This is beyond useless

Contraporky:

Antisemitism and Anti-zionism are conceptually not the same and conflating them is dangerous but [long spiel about how it's really important to consider the feelings of the genocidal US-backed ethnostate]

Rabbi Elhanan Beck, London-based Orthodox Jewish Leader:

What is the least safe place in the world for Jews? It is Israel. It started with the Nakba against the Palestinians. The state of Israel is a rebellion against God and they will not succeed. They will come to an end. A person who can justify genocide, a person who can commit genocide is more nazi than Jew.

As usual leftists have championed a doomed cause

Perhaps Contra will end up being correct. But, do the Palestinians want us to do anything else? The Palestinians I have spoken to have sometimes resigned themselves to the idea that they might have a doomed cause, have they asked me to stop championing that cause? No. Why? Every single one of them wants to TRY.

And that's what matters. That you try.

Andor's Nemik speech is extremely fitting here. It may be true that many causes are doomed to fail, but each and every single act of trying is creating more people that are united in the cause of opposing the empire. Ghorman is a doomed cause from the start, there was no saving it even if they had the entire enemy plan it would be carried out effectively, but what its doom creates is millions if not tens of millions of people in opposition to the empire.

The very same can be said of Palestine. They may be doomed, or they may not be, but speaking of doom is not useful. TRY.

Contra does not want to try because it does not benefit her liberal politics. She is a supporter of the empire, not opposition to it, and she knows that our attempts to try create people that are to the left of her, which is not beneficial to her cause.

the way Israel is perceived does seep out into attitudes towards jews in general

No it does not. This is completely bullshit. The antisemites will have that attitude towards jews regardless of the situation in Palestine, and everyone else will immediately love every jew who says "i am not a zionist". The only jews affected by this situation are zionists, they are not affected because they are jews, they are affected because they are zionists. Every single one of them can disarm any negativity towards themselves immediately by saying they're anti zionist.

And finally I just want to point out that this whole post exists to disguise the fact she's admitting that her position is two-state zionism but without actually saying Palestinians should have a state.

Separating decent people from genocidal fascists.

Someone should tell her:

• https://mondoweiss.net/2025/07/poll-overwhelming-majority-of-jewish-israelis-share-genocidal-belief-there-are-no-innocent-people-in-gaza/

Poll: Overwhelming majority of Jewish Israelis share genocidal belief there are ‘no innocent people in Gaza’

Echoing the words of martyr Aaron Bushnell, What would you have done during the holocaust: you're doing it right now.

'the dissolution of Israel as a Jewish state' i.e. universal suffrage

i hate the trend of "is it a genocide? yes. will that stop me from supporting zionism? no." absolutely fuck off

Genuinely revolting to read, caping for genocide is fucking disgusting, and it wasn't even debatable pre-Oct 7th. We now see genocide happening in real time, and she capes for it.

I don't really know why I bothered to write this, but I'll post it anyway:

As usual, leftists have championed a doomed cause

What the fuck do you champion with your platform, Nat? Congratulations on being a pioneering voice in letting us know that 4channers are bad, congrats on your incredible victory that has long stopped reaching anyone who didn't already understand that, now what about the imperialism that characterizes the global order? Oh, right, opposing it is infeasible because Dems won't vote for it.

It's crazy how she says that anti-Zionism is necessarily a losing battle with a "shrunken" coalition relative to the "coalition" that includes lib zios, but then a few lines later acknowledges that "Anti-Zionist" as a label is "now-popular," but only to talk about Nazis using the title. So it's hopelessly unpopular when it comes to doing good things but powerfully mainstream for doing bad things, with no causal differentiation.

God, I already hate her, but the fact that she would just come out and attack anti-zionism overall is somewhat more reactionary than I expected, albeit a more honest version of what I assumed her opinion would be.

[In reference to documentation of the genocide and these images upsetting people] Antisemitism and Anti-Zionism are conceptually not the same, and conflating them is dangerous. But . . .

She did the meme. Continued:

But in practice, the way Israel is perceived does seep out into attitudes toward Jews in general. I don't think Jews who feel isolated and wary in the current atmosphere are simply hysterical or hallucinating.

Yes, there's communal trauma and hypervigilance. Yes, there's disingenuous rightwing ghouls dismissing and censoring all criticism of Israel on the pretext of "fighting antisemitism." But there's also a valid fear of historical antisemitic patterns recurring, and that fear gives power to the rightwing Zionist claim that only Israel can keep Jews safe.

Does this mean Israel cannot be criticized and sanctioned? Absolutely not.

But it's something I don't want to risk contributing to if not outweighed by tangible benefits. So, I approached the issue cautiously.

For the first time in years, Nat demonstrates concerns about tangible benefits and the risks of playing into reactionary tropes, something that has never occurred to her when she bashes communists (both anarchists and MLs, especially Mao for some reason).

I can absolutely see how this looks Reasonable and like she's being The Adult in the Room if you're a liberal, and my criticism of this is something it's pretty easy to handwave if you are motivated by liking her output and being overly charitable, but one of the more awful parts about this, and the reason I transcribed that segment in full, is that she is completely vague about "rightwing ghouls" and does not make clear at all in this statement how Israel itself and its entire fucking edifice is based on the conflation that she's talking about, that she's talking about the end result of the primary defensive strategy of hasbarists. She can't say this, because then her statement would amount to "Israel is using Jews as human shields, so I can't attack Israel because then I'd be endangering the human shields. Never mind that millions of people coming to harm was already the status quo and I could try to help interfere, Israel's hostage-taking has immobilized me, even though my hypothetical long-winded video essay would never have a message that could be conflated with Nazi-style antisemitism regardless." She can't say this because she would sound completely ridiculous. (I said "Nazi-style" because I think she could pretty easily produce some zionist-style antisemitism and gets close to doing it even here with the nebulous connection between "Israel" and "Jews in general" she draws in the first part of the last quote).

Edit: Also, "historical antisemitic patterns reoccuring" isn't going to come from the crowd of Leftists in keffiyehs! They aren't the ones who will go hunt down all the Jews for betraying Jesus or preventing their country's glorious victory in the Great War. The Zionist crowd is the one who would produce such action, though in practice in a place like America we are far from there structurally (not that stochastic attacks are acceptable, but those were already going on and the evidence presented of them increasing in number is muddled by zio misreporting, and very little compared to both systemic and stochastic Islamophobic attacks, something she never even hints at existing).

Zero Palestinian lives were saved. Not one fewer bomb or bullet was fired by the IDF.

Then why "quietly" donate to charities, Nat? Zero people were saved? Did all the fundraising, all the relocated refugees, not accomplish anything at all? Or are you just so obsessed with depicting people to your left as useless that you'd cynically misrepresent an ongoing genocide to score points? Never mind the sabotage and pressure campaigns that did actually concretely stop shipments to Israel, albeit not on the totalizing scale we would hope for.

It may have slightly contributed to the reelection of Trump, guaranteeing that the US will put not diplomatic pressure on Netanyahu for at least four years,

First of all, if the war factored into the election, it was the fault of the Democrats for being zionists, not the fault of voters being less enthusiastic for a zionist. Do you not understand how voting is even theoretically supposed to work? This is a real "the Democrats can only be failed" argument.

Oh yeah, and it was an open secret for over a year now that the Biden admin was putting no pressure on Bibi, and somewhat recently became fully a non-secret because Israeli politicians have been bragging about it! I sure wonder there's some other motivation here that has resulted in you putting forth these blatant falsehoods to, and it can't be stressed enough, smear the opposition to a genocide!

Trump is also, incidentally, a menace to me and basically everyone I care about. A perfectly enlightened being would feel no bitterness about this, but I do.

This could be the entire post. Just these two sentences, rephrased slightly for context.

What about the people who are menaced by the Dems as well? Oh, sorry, some voteblues showed me a trolley problem meme and I realized that solidarity isn't the best way to optimize for my well-being on the timescale of one election cycle, so forget about those other people.

None of this is the fault of the Palestinians, of course, who are overwhelmingly the victims here.

Bless your heart. We all know that you're posting this as a bitter tirade against the anglosphere left, you don't need to say it via negativa too.

I hope that someday American policy will shift in their favor, and I will continue to support that cause.

I hope this requires no comment for how pathetic and disingenuous this statement is.

I see the situation as bleak, intractable, extremely divisive . . .

Die in a ditch, Natalie.

Your strategy of endlessly critiquing power pales in comparison to my strategy of critiquing the powerless endlessly.

“being against white supremacy is bad for the left because lots of white people are white supremacists”

ok KKKrackerpoints

I fucking hate liberals so much.

I get why she always seems to be drinking, I too would want to be unconscious of my soul if it was as dark as hers.

Idealists always say that there's no reasonable path to destroying Israel through mass struggle and then in the same breath say the reasonable goal is actually transforming the genocidal colonial ethnostate into a pluralistic democracy as if that's more attainable.

Inevitably they always feel the same way about the dictatorship of the proletariat too.

"Anti-zionism is just an unrealistic doomed cause! Unlike the two state solution, which is totally viable..."

God damn, she’s even long winded in text.

I ain’t reading all that

she was right about exactly one thing and it's that she really did not need to post this

"Every Westerner is a nazi" seems to hold true often these days...

lmao she can't read the room for shit, this racist, genocide supporting, euphemistic drivel doesn't even work on chuds because they've moved on to outright nazism and open glee at mass child murder

This soft-nazism would've played moderately well among democrat aligned progressive circles circa 2012, but now it has the same valence as someone saying in 2020 George Floyd deserved to die because "he didn't listen"

75% of democrats despise Israel, the same soft lib demographic she's cultivated, she's gonna get torn apart for this

more like Natalie wrong

If she is writing this a month after the 7th of October it would work, but we are at the point where the Israeli government talks about concentrating 600k people into a camp build on the ruins of Rafah that would be used to vet people for eventual transfer.

Attempting to be very clever lampshading demand for her own opinions as demand for 'A ContraPoints Video'- 'you aren't asking me to use some of my influence to talk about the genocide, you're demanding my labour for an entertainment video, I am actually very enlightened to not make entertainment of this'

She's not taking the left-aligned stance.

She's not taking the right-aligned stance.

She is just Justifying...the ethnic cleansing.