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The Real Reason the Democrats are Attacking Jill Stein "is because they don't want voters to know that there can be a worker-centered party to the left of the Democrats" (xcancel.com)
submitted 8 months ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
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Democrats aren't attacking Jill Stein because they think she is taking votes from Kamala Harris. No one I know who's voting Green would consider a vote for Harris at this point. They're attacking Jill Stein because they don't want voters to know that there can be a worker-centered party to the left of the Democrats that supports popular policies like Medicare for All, a $25 wage and federally guaranteed housing.

There are 80+ million eligible voters who don't vote at all because they don't see the point. Democrats are okay with this, in fact, they don't want any candidate to their left to appeal to those voters with popular policies.

The fact that the Green Party exists shows that the Democrats aren't pushing the most progressive policies. Jill Stein's candidacy shows that it's possible to support reproductive justice AND be against funding and arming a genocide. That we can end homelessness if we stopped funding endless wars around the globe.

Democrats don't want anyone to the left of them to exist because it's the only way they can convince Americans that Dem policies are "the best that we can do". To Dems, anything else is just "asking for a pony".

Don't fall for it. Despite Dem's desire to have you think otherwise, things don't have to be this way.

Another world is possible.

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[–] [email protected] 28 points 8 months ago (26 children)

No. It's because if you're not voting for Harris (if you're voting for another candidate or abstaining from voting at all) you are supporting a Trump presidency.

That's how our elections work. No one likes it but these are the facts. I beg you, get your head out of your idealistic ass and vote for the only candidate who has the opportunity to prevent a Trump presidency.

be against funding and arming a genocide.

I implore you, if you at all believe in a free Palestine, you will take action to vote for Harris. Don't empower Trump to eradicate Palestine.

I was idealistic when I was young too. It's incredibly frustrating that government is so slow. But, from my perspective, it's due to so many people not using their voices that our representatives aren't representative of us. You have to work with the tools we have. You have to compromise and move slowly towards the things you want. It's the down-ballot elections that you need to focus on. You need to build up these "fringe" political parties from within the cities. You need to work with civic leaders to move towards ranked choice or star voting. You need to work towards eliminating corporate investment in elections. By taking a stand at the highest level of government, you are counter productive to your own interests.

[–] [email protected] 34 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (8 children)

I implore you, if you at all believe in a free Palestine, you will take action to vote for Harris.

Voting for a candidate who has vowed to continue a genocide will not, in fact, stop the genocide.

You have to work with the tools we have.

Bourgeois democracy will never willingly hand you the tools to dismantle itself. Nothing other than revolution will ever dismantle this system of genocide and working class oppression.

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[–] [email protected] 34 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago) (28 children)

if you at all believe in a free Palestine, you will take action to vote for Harris

How? Harris isn't even allowing Palestinian Americans to speak. She isn't even trying to appeal to them or acknowledge them.

I was idealistic when I was young too

Thanks for the compliment but my bad back calls bullshit on me being young.

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[–] [email protected] 31 points 8 months ago

Actually by not voting for Trump I am supporting Harris

[–] [email protected] 26 points 8 months ago

I'm voting for neither Republicans or Democrats so that means I'm voting for both both-sides

[–] [email protected] 20 points 8 months ago (4 children)

It must be exhausting always rooting for the antihero.

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

This is so naive I'm gonna have to assume you're a literal child.

So actually the way voting works is if you vote for a candidate then they get your vote and if you vote for another candidate, then that candidate gets your vote and if you vote for a third candidate, then that candidate gets your vote and if you don't vote for any candidate then no candidate gets your vote.
Oh boy politics sure are complicated, huh? The only way your idea of 'how voting works' would in any way approach rationality, would be if you assumed that the democrats were somehow owed our votes. That doesn't really make sense. The way it actually works is that a party - or a candidate - courts voters by appealing to their interests and presenting themselves as a reliable steward for advancing those interests. If a candidate or a party fails in this, then they lose. In other words: If you want people to vote for you, listen to what they want you to do and then do that. Kamala Harris' campaign is a great example of what happens when you don't do that.

We don't count the amount of not-votes a candidate gets, only the votes. But if it makes you feel any better we can say I'm not voting for Trump 1 million times and I'll only be not voting for Harris 100.000 times. We can even say I'm not voting for him in swing states! Hope that clears your heart flutters just a little so you can cool your head and let go of those no-no words.

Or Trump will eradicate Palestine.

Okay sweetie, so there's actually a genocide going on right now. You probably don't follow the news, but palestinians are being put in concentration camps and mass graves. And Harris has said she will increase support! I don't even know how it can get worse over there, but she has promised she's gonna let it get worse.
Do you know what a genocide is? Probably not, because if you did you wouldn't be running your mouth saying wacky stuff like your doing. The end point of genocide is extermination. The end result is Palestine being eradicated.
I know this can all be terribly abstract, so I'll try to help you understand what is going on. Now sweetie this will be a bit scary and it does contain some no-no words and I'm sorry about that, but I do feel it's necessary to make you understand. Still I don't want to shock you or traumatize you, so I'm gonna put it behind

this little tag

Booh! Scared you! Teehee. Sorry for the prank, but it's actually just a link to a discussion I had with a real meanie-poo >:( But I thought it would be better to give you a two-stage launch so you can really prepare yourself for reading some super scary stuff. Don't want you to be too scared to go to sleep at bedtime, now do we?

and when you feel comfortable and safe, then you can just click it and read it. Maybe have a juice brick next to you so you can have a sippy if you get scared.

But from my perspective it's due to not using our voices

Oh boy you sure are the first person to come with that analysis. You know liberal "democracies" are actually incredibly understudied, especially on the left. There's barely any text on the faults of electorialism, so I'm super glad to see your little theory you brewed up all on your own there. Proud of you buddy. If you wanna expand your horizons a bit, then here's a little bit of literature. Don't get scared by the fact there's no pictures! I know you can do it!

Now you can probably figure out since I linked you a few texts that I'm being a bit facetious. And you got me. Good on you again! Maybe you can use that big brain of yours and think yourself some humility, it would do you some good. Maybe assume that the bare-bones drivel (sorry buddy, but it's really not very good) you're serving us as some unique insight, isn't really novel or unknown to us. We all exist in this society, we all see the same takes on the frontpage of reddit, we just... You know, think a little about it. We're a little curious over here. A curious little group of people that likes to just look a teeny tiny bit deeper instead of just incorporating whatever the TV told us that morning. Maybe you should consider doing the same yourself.

You have to compromise and move things slowly forwards.

Aw buddy, did you discover incrementalism? I remember when I did too, it sounded real swell. Sadly it doesn't really work, we've been hearing that stuff since the 1970's. Really we heard it before that too. I'm sorry to be the one to tell you that, I know it sucks to learn you're not the brightest bulb in the room. Hopefully this can be a learning experience for you!

[–] [email protected] 10 points 8 months ago

Incredible I can just repost this comment more or less word for word you people truly are NPC's.

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 8 months ago

Look, I want parties way to the left of the Democrats, but we need to change the voting system before that's viable. Right now, in an election against Trump? Get your heads out of your asses.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 8 months ago (2 children)

This is an interesting perspective that I haven't thought of or considered.

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[–] [email protected] 10 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Fearmongering is the imaginary fence which keeps all Democrats locked where they are.

Once the dam breaks and the Green party has a winning chance voters will flock to Greens in droves.

They are definitely trying to censor Jill to keep the Greens from reaching the critical mass needed to have a chance at winning.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 8 months ago (7 children)

A socialist party would be nice in u.s politics.

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[–] [email protected] 8 points 8 months ago (1 children)

I feel like the real reason Democrats would be attacking her would be due to her happily accepting donations from Republican led sponsors, aiming to actively sway Democratic voters instead of specifically both, and the distance that she has from actual election given that she's not on the ballot in a number of states and is posing herself as the anti-war candidate despite saying that Russia invaded Ukraine because they needed to defend themselves from nukes. Odd how it's okay to be apologetic to Russia but not Israel. You must understand - as a third party they can claim to have a plan for world peace, but what members in Congress will sponsor those bills? Even if Jill Stein did become President, who is approving her policies?

All that aside -- she does very little in between election years. The Green Party as a whole has accomplished less of its supposed goals while having far more funding than the SRA. I would also expect that the leader of the Green Party practice what she preaches, as her and her husband have stock in just as many oil companies as the Democrats do. So quite honestly, it's hard to see her as anyone but a faux candidate who shows up to take money from Green Party voters, preventing actual change from happening with that money because it's going into a candidacy that will go nowhere.

If she cared, she would campaign for her donations to be given to something that would actually have meaningful effects, and she would push for more local candidates to run. The sad fact of the matter is that the Green Party has candidates who start out Green then move to a different party and are completely happy taking donations from Big Oil just like Kyrsten Sinema.

To call the Democrats a joke party when the tactics of the Green Party have been laughable is just one reason why they aren't taken seriously. Another would be this quote:

there are more open socialists in just the New York state legislature right now (8, all caucusing together, will be 9 next year) than have been elected total above the local level for the Green Party (5). even accounting for party switching, this expands to just 9 people in history.

We can also just look at the Public Office Holders for the Socialists and the Green Party.

In short -- The Green Party is the vote of choice because there is a Presidential candidate, but they offer nothing else through the four years. People are asking where the Democrats have been for them, what about the Green Party? Why are they all too happy to take money from you but do nothing in between for local activism? People are saying that the Democrats only provide lip service when they say things like supporting a two state solution, but lip service from the Green Party is totally fine? The Socialists or the DSA seem to at least aim for actionable goals, but is there no support for them because there's no Presidential candidate? We've also seen that they (Socialists) actually have a chance of being elected if they run on a democratic platform and push bills that we can be proud of, something that historically cannot be said for members of the Green Party.

I hope this provides some insight on why people, not just Democrats, don't feel like the Green Party is a worthwhile option.

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