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I really like how the “empirical” evidence for god’s existence is just “math has rules and there are patterns in nature, therefore god exists” (hexbear.net)

submitted 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

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And you know what, that might just very well be true if we’re talking about some supernatural force that is indifferent to its creations, not out of malice, but because it simply is truly neutral.

But as evidence for the religious capital ‘G’ God, the one who communicates and plans every little detail because he loves us so much? What is the point of these “subtle” proofs that took thousands of years to be studied and recorded when he has shown that he can just pop up anywhere or perform miracles and whatever the fuck.

It is no coincidence that the vast majority, possibly 99%, of devout religious people do not give a shit about using math to explain god because it’s all proven in their holy books. It is no coincidence that the “empirical” evidence is, in reality, just pointing at the existence of features and concepts of math and science rather than utilizing said features and concepts to prove the existence of god. And no, philosophical musings about morality using the language of mathematical proofs does not count as utilizing math and science (literally, all the axioms in these types of "proofs" are subjective shit like "bad" and "good" and not, say, the difference between 1 and 0).

And I didn’t even want to make a post dunking on religion, but I’m irritated because YouTube recommended some dumbass video by a channel called “Reformed Zoomer” and one of the arguments is “there is an infinite range of numbers between two numbers, and if we turn those numbers into letters, then every book possible has already been written. Checkmate atheoids”. https://youtu.be/z0hxb5UVaNE?si=RpjF6S0fHiF71iH-

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[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 years ago

If the position of everything (particles, subatomic units, energy) is just cause and effect since when everything started, or since any point in time after everything existed regardless of how it came about, then there's obviously no free will.

Hard pills to swallow: atoms don't stop following the laws of physics when they're in the shape of a human brain. behavior and subjectivity are direct results of the matter in your head.

I've seen arguments from scientifically minded folks for why they believe in "free will" and they always involve misunderstanding physics, neuroscience, or free will itself.

It always comes off as cope.

Unfortunately I don't think we can prove or disprove from within reality whether or not it is all deterministic.

It's common for an argument to hinge on the randomness of quantum mechanics (whether quantum randomness is even relevant in brain function is an open question, but it probably isn't), but that confuses free will with unpredicatbility. Do you have "free will" if your behaviors are the result of dice rolls, the outcome of which you cannot control?