this post was submitted on 13 Nov 2023
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askchapo
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He'd have to be worse than Trump which is basically impossible. I will not abstain, I will chose the leader I want or, barring that, the least worst option. Biden it is.
Me: A vote for Biden is a vote for genocide
You: A vote for Biden is a vote for genocide
Why is Trump "impossibly" worse? And yes this is a trap question so pick your reasons carefully, cause I've noticed liberals have no clue or pretend to have no clue about the things Biden's done
Definitely a response of someone confident in their assertions
It's a religious belief.
The idea that Biden is better than trump is so self-evident to them that it doesn't require any justification. They think you're trolling because you're asking something so obvious.
You're voting for the genocide of an indigenous colonized society.
What was Trump doing that Biden currently isn't also doing, just while not bloviating to the the media about how cool he is for doing it?
you're a condescending prick. shut the fuck up liberal
Death to America
Do you personally believe that it's possible to use a vote as leverage to get policies you want or better align with?
I don't believe the US system allows for that, no. Everything is a game and we are basically forced to choose between capitalists and fascists. But within that terrible system there still is a choice which is better than nothing. I may be choosing Kang but at least it's better than Kodos.
I think local politics can be influenced by volunteering but even then money can ruin it (as it did in my town last week).
You could take a third option.
I'm not trying to set you up for a dunk, but why do you vote if you don't think it can be used as leverage?
From how you describe, it doesn't seem like a choice outside of aesthetics at this point. I believe that if I refuse to show up or participate in voting the general and stay consistent with my views, that I'm not passively accepting the lower standards we're presented. I'm also not endorsing, defending, or carrying water for candidates who are commiting or enabling crimes against humanity.
My personal concern is that a broad acceptance of Biden as the preferable outcome between two inevitable outcomes limits the conversation on what kind of world is possible. The DNC still has time to course correct and be on the right side of history.
Voting nationally is a low leverage action, but abstaining is a no leverage action. So to have any leverage at all I must vote, and since I'm voting I'm going to vote for the best/least worst candidate. Diamond Joe does some shitty things but Trump is another ambitious, poorly spoken level, his treacheries have treacheries. I don't have a viable third option so this is where I'm at.
We had a chance at real change in 2016 and it was taken away. If that happens again I am all in but I don't see any beneficial action right now to make that a reality.
What do you mean we had a chance at real change in 2016??
Before that
You can't mean Bernie, the guy who also will not even call for a ceasefire from Israel...
If you ask for someone that takes a hard line stance in 100% agreement with you, you'll never get it. Find the best option you can in a given situation and roll with it. Push back on the differences, try to move policy where you want it to go, but understand you cannot always have your way 100% of the time in a world with other humans.
In other words, don't let perfect be the enemy of better. What is the alternative?
You know that saying is usually reserved for minor differences in policy, not for allowing the deaths of thousands
Yeah we've mostly soured on Bernie since he endorsed his good friend Genocide Joe and even more so with his recent support for the genocide
https://youtu.be/CL5Hme-TVFs?si=cVjgssfOAzg8kbNl
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
Abstaining is how voting can have leverage. Voting only has leverage if politicians can't take your vote as a given