this post was submitted on 30 Oct 2023
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[–] [email protected] 27 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I'm now starting to believe that images like these are the reason plant-based milk alternatives aren't allowed to be called milk in Germany

[–] [email protected] 27 points 2 years ago (3 children)

It clearly has nothing to do with the dairy lobby pushing hard everywhere to prevent people from switching to ecologically and humanely better alternative because they don't want to lose the fat subsidies they get from the government.

They try to push these legislations under the guise that it could induce the consumer in error, my ass.

Let's blame fun cartoons instead.

Let's not forget the cost with their lives the cows have to bear for us to get milk.

Forcefully impregnated, their babies taken away to be slaughtered as veal or to become milk cows. And all that for a fraction of their lifespan only to be slaughtered when their milk production starts to decline...

https://ourworldindata.org/environmental-impact-milks

https://insideclimatenews.org/news/02042021/meat-dairy-lobby-climate-action/

At least sometimes there is a bit of push back: https://www.just-food.com/news/eu-rejects-dairy-lobby-proposals-to-restrict-plant-based-alternatives/

[–] [email protected] 17 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I appreciate the passion, my comment was still just a joke though.

That being said, I saw oat milk yesterday at the same price as cow milk. In other words, not even the financial incentive is left for me to buy cow milk.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Hey thanks for the precision. The frustration was not directed at you directly, moreso at the argument I thought you were making, I apologize for that. I have just heard this fallacious argument so many time in real life used seriously that I react strongly to it.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Oh, I understand that. So many industries pull all kinds of bs to look better than they have any business to, it really is infuriating.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

NGL spy milk is fire in coffee

I still (currently) prefer milk (lactose free (specifically dairy gold fit)) in my tea though

Spy milk just has the wrong texture for tea IMO

Edit: Meant soy but it got autocorrected to spy. I'm going to leave it as it's too funny to not.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 years ago

Spy milk sounds like what Bond girls are left with at the hotel room

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Or maybe just because they aren't actually milk

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 years ago

I guess words can't be used in different context, especially when the plant-based alternatives are drop-in replacement for animal milks and the term has been used for hundreds of year to describe both plant-based milky substances and animal secretions.

Source: https://english.stackexchange.com/a/478323

[–] naevaTheRat 9 points 2 years ago

Milk of the poppy, milk thistle, milk of magnesia...

it's almost like the word means a white liquid, of which mammalian breast milk is one type.

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

hardly any calves become veal at all. it's a slim percentage.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

The dairy industry can have a little cruelty to calves, as a treat.

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

If you buy the products, you're complicit. Sounds like people are pretty okay with it to me.

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

i buy petroleum products. i disagree with most of the aspects of their procurement, distribution, and use. if i stop buying them, none of that changes.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (2 children)

Petroleum production decreases as we implement alternatives. Are you really going to tell me this isn't the case? 🤣

ETA: You know, for someone named commie, you're spouting a lot of neoliberal nonsense. "Ah, no sense trying to change anything even if we don't agree with it."

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

i'm telling you there is no causal mechanism by which consumption dictates production.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

You're really gonna tell me that meat production will be unchanged as more people have been adopting a plant-based diet. Good thing you don't run Tyson, they've been having to close meat processing plants due to decreased demand.

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago (3 children)

You’re really gonna tell me that meat production will be unchanged as more people have been adopting a plant-based diet.

meat production continues to GROW even as MORE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN ADOPTING A PLANT-BASED DIET.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Correlation != causation. Left unchecked, production will inevitably see some increase due to WHAT?! Increased population. However, anticipated growth hasn't met expectations. Gee, almost like there's a reason...

After that, I wonder how much production would decrease if we stopped giving animal agriculture their multi-billion dollar shot in the arm every year from the USDA versus the few million that plant alternatives gets. Wonder what would happen if we reversed that...

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

production will inevitably see some increase due to WHAT

i don't think it's inevitable that population increase leads to increased production. this is another example of an assertion of a causal link where no such link exists.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

i wasn't aware "fuck it, nothing can improve, everything will always suck" was a communist principle

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

that's the beauty of paraphrase, it captures the essence of expression without having to be a literal equivalent transcript of it

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago

that's not a paraphrase. that's a straw man.

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Correlation != causation.

i felt like this was the lesson i was trying to teach you.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago (10 children)

No, the "lesson" you're trying to teach is that just because the movement isn't popular, it isn't worth doing. You're making logical fallacies to equate our morality-based struggle to something like needing gasoline to get to work because you refuse to agitate for better public transit or buying a fucking bicycle. Not only that, but your methodology is flawed, and I merely stated as such in your irrelevant context just to make a point. Your apathy to change doesn't mean it isn't worth doing. Slavery was considered a normal part of everyday life until people agitated against it. People had no qualms destroying the environment until people agitated against it. Animal abuse was rampant in the past, and now we've enacted laws against it. Your argument is trash because you are so apathetic to non-human suffering, you couldn't possibly fathom the notion that we could do things better and treat others better. Instead of being the ones exploiting, we can be caretakers. All social movements start out small and slow. Once they hit a threshold point, they explode into the collective conscience. So yeah, I'm going to keep agitating to remind people that they're the ones propping up this veritable holocaust where we murder billions of land animals every year for sensory pleasure, when a better way of living has been available to us for well over a hundred years now. Just that people use your hollow arguments to bemoan that it sounds like it's not worth doing because it's "too hard." It's not too hard, you're just selfish. OR, you could opt to actually dabble in empathy and get in on the ground floor. You'd get to say you were vegan before it was cool.

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago

we murder billions of land animals

I don't do that. no one does.

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago

No, the "lesson" you're trying to teach is that just because the movement isn't popular, it isn't worth doing.

I told you what I meant. don't put words in my mouth

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago

You're making logical fallacies

no, I'm not

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago

Slavery was considered a normal part of everyday life until people agitated against it. People had no qualms destroying the environment until people agitated against it. Animal abuse was rampant in the past, and now we've enacted laws against it.

none of this was solved by buying beans

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago

you're just selfish.

this is a personal attack, not evidence that buying beans will save the environment

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago

we murder billions of land animals every year for sensory pleasure

I'm pretty sure most animals are killed for convenience or profit.

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago

you are so apathetic to non-human suffering, you couldn't possibly fathom the notion that we could do things better and treat others better.

this has nothing to do with the efficacy of buying beans

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago

you refuse to agitate for better public transit or buying a fucking bicycle.

you don't know what I do

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

you could opt to actually dabble in empathy

implying I don't have empathy is a personal attack, not evidence that buying beans would shrink agricultural emissions.

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[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

“Ah, no sense trying to change anything even if we don’t agree with it.”

that's not what i'm saying. i'm saying being vegan isn't an effective way to change anything.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

journey of a thousand miles, etc.

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

this platitude doesn't make buying beans an effective way to reduce the ecological burden of agriculture

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

neither is fatalism an effective way to encourage change

[–] commie 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

i'm not being fatalistic. i just don't believe buying beans is an effective way to fix the ecological problems of agriculture.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

From what I've learned, this is called the "fuck it" principle. It doesn't make enough of a difference, so don't bother doing it.

It's a fallacy though.

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[–] [email protected] 14 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I have a few questions, but I’m not sure I want the answers.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 years ago

Let the curiosity flow through you

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 years ago (1 children)

What's with the candy corn? 🌽

[–] [email protected] 14 points 2 years ago

Candy corn is a brood parasite who plants its young in almond nests to leech off of their resources and be raised as one of their own.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 years ago

Brood parasitism

[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 years ago

because the candy corn grows quicker than almonds, it will instinctively push the almondlings out of the nest leaving them to starve, thereby culling the competition to its parasitic consumption of unknowing mother's milk

[–] [email protected] 8 points 2 years ago

I'm going back to bed

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