A sleepy morning idea - forcefully convert Boeing into a cooperative. It being strategically important and all.
this post was submitted on 14 Sep 2024
140 points (100.0% liked)
unions
2139 readers
55 users here now
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
top 16 comments
sorted by:
hot
top
controversial
new
old
Fuck people that think like this.
"I only get paid as much as a fast food worker and I can't afford to live. Only I deserve a living wage, not a lower person like a fast food worker"
Fuck you and fuck that, if you work, you should be paid a living wage. Simple as that without any exceptions.
They're not complaining that a panda Express employee is making too much, they're complaining that an aircraft mechanic is making too little.
If an aircraft mechanic, who needs long term training and a high level of skill, can walk off the job and get paid the same working fast food, then that's a problem.
If a fast food worker doesn't get paid a living wage, that's also a problem, but a different one, and has nothing to do with their argument.
I understand the logic on how an aircraft mechanic should be paid more. It has nothing to do with panda express. That part of the argument can go. "I'm not being paid enough for my specialty, we should bargain for better rates" is enough.
That's not entirely true, the idea of specialized jobs being paid more is due to the fact the worker had to invest time or money into the skill. The point being made is that a low skilled job generally shouldn't be paid more than a skilled job, due to education/training costs.
That's the arguement being made, and drawing attention to the fact that Boeing could lose generations of techs to other careers (forever) if they don't act now. Because once someone moves away from the field, it's hard (time and money) to bring them back.
If that's what the market is doing, then an aircraft mechanic should go to work for Panada Express. That's how this system works. Until people start playing the game, nothing changes it seems... well hopefully union gets a fat W here but you get my point... how did Union let this shit this bad?
Only reason why Boeing is even in this position is because planes are poorly built and they killed a guy so the peasants ready to eat them, I bet if not for these factors, we would not even be having this conversation right now.
Usually people study a subject because they're at least interested in it. What you're saying is like asking a surgeon to work in IT, for instance, just because they're paying more. That's not a fair game, we're humans with our skills, perks, defects... you can't pretend everyone moves like a pawn just for money.
Boeing, like many other companies is playing the game of "maximise the short term profit" and as usual the easiest way is to cut labour costs. That's why they're in this position (poorly built planes, killed HUNDREDS of people etc.)
Usually people study a subject because they're at least interested in it.
I understand this but the job market is taking advantage of people being locked in AND/OR unwillingness to switch jobs/careers as needed.
What you're saying is like asking a surgeon to work in IT, for instance, just because they're paying more.
An extreme example and nearly impossible. But people can switch jobs/careers and my thesis that they must, otherwise they get locked into these clown ass relationships for decades where wages of fast food worker actually increased beyond their own. I understand that Boeing is a state funded corporate scam but at some point people need have to help themselves since clear US government does not give any fucks and union did not do its job.
That's not a fair game, we're humans with our skills, perks, defects... you can't pretend everyone moves like a pawn just for money.
People who are able to "move like a pawn" is the guy who gets paid. Nobody likes it but staying in a job for low pay when you can get better paid job is not a solution either.
We have a system that requires people to be on the move if they want market rate wage. We can argue about how shiti this is but at the end of the day, people who can need to go and get paid more. This helps everybody but the corporate scammers.
"if you work, you should be paid a living wage. Simple as that without any exceptions."
Then why are you bitching at the engineers who are asking to be paid a living wage?
I think its pretty easy to determine what I was saying. They do deserve to be paid more, but it's not because panda express is paying more. Shitting on someone else in the workforce does not help you get a raise, it helps you stay divided against each other instead of super wealthy fucking you both over.
Shit man, on an ideologic level I agree with what you said.
On a humanistic level, these guys aren't perfect, and what they are saying is probably very emotionally driven right now. It's not supportive to the unionization cause to hate on them at the moment; support them in the short term, and reflect/educate on their conduct in the longer-term.
You're right. Thanks for pointing that out. It wasn't meant to be only pointed directly at these folks, more so the all of the people that are okay with "certain people" not deserving a living wage, famously McDonalds employees. I think solidarity between both groups will achieve more is all.
I won't lie, seeing an Aldi worker can now potentially make more than me does sting but, not because the Aldi worker doesn't deserve money, because I do have a more valuable position in my company than a cashier does at Aldi and with that in mind I see how much my company under values me.
Does that make sense? The mechanics hear how much education and skill they need from Boeing and then hear that's the market rate for... a fast food worker. Arguably, a fast food worker needs more interpersonal skills than a mechanic and has to constantly be the face of the business but for Boeing to land fat government contacts and then say they value their mechanics as much as Panda Express does it's line cooks, well, it hurts.
it does make sense.
|I see how much my company under values me.
This should be enough, looking at the positions pay in the past and how that's adjusted for cost of living and inflation should be all the needed argument for a better wage.