this post was submitted on 13 Nov 2023
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Anarchism

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Discuss anarchist praxis and philosophy. Don't take yourselves too seriously.


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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.world/post/8181688

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[–] [email protected] 41 points 2 years ago (8 children)

Hexbear comes here to be the debate bros they try so hard to dunk on. They are dying looking for just one little morsel of dunk. Not a good showing, not a leftist unity moment lmao

[–] [email protected] 42 points 2 years ago (2 children)

The post exclusively attacks Hexbear's ideological "left unity" position so it's kinda fair game for people from that position to want to say something in its defence.

The people doing marxist sectarianism instead of defending left unity are being dummies though.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 2 years ago (1 children)

The people doing marxist sectarianism instead of defending left unity are being dummies though.

I mean you can't expect marxists to not critique anarchists? Left unity, yeah we can do that, but not arguing about everything with everyone? Nah.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 2 years ago

Depends. There's a line it crosses from maintaining left unity while doing critique versus becoming sectarianism, and it's not useful when it is.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Yes to the first part. Although, I'll take this moment to say: hexbear's left unity could use a tune up

I'm just trying to talk about the latter behavior you described, which is kindof a symptom of what I mentioned

[–] [email protected] 24 points 2 years ago

Yeah I agree.

I think the issue here is that since left unity only has enforcement onsite, some are baited into sectarian arguments offsite.

There's also the issue that this is specifically posing left-unity as a marxist trick.

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[–] [email protected] 34 points 2 years ago (1 children)

What could be more left unity than MLs and anarchists coming together to embarass liberals?

[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 years ago

antler-bernie I am once again asking the mods for a new site headline

[–] [email protected] 31 points 2 years ago (1 children)

this meme is explicitly anti-left unity, as is the OP

[–] [email protected] 5 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I think the meme is a not-so-great way to address a dark topic.

But what I was talking about was the behavior of hexbear users in response that is also not cool.

But also I was just kinda fuckin around being entertained by the arguing and trying not to take it too seriously. I'm not here to take a strong stance. People seem to wanna make me take one but I'm gunna keep trying not to give a shit.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 years ago (1 children)

"I was just doing a bit, and you can tell how bothsides I am by how good the bit landed"

smuglord

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[–] [email protected] 27 points 2 years ago (2 children)

not a leftist unity moment l

You can't be a fucker like OP and then complain about the lack of unity in response

[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I'm not complaining, I'm entertained.

And mostly using that language was me trying to reference the meme, try to bring it all full circle.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Would you say you're actually laughing?

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[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 years ago (4 children)

Oh no, there is unity. From the he bear users that came in as a brigade to drive the discussion out of the instance's users. There's more hexbear coments than any other instance what the fuck.

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[–] [email protected] 26 points 2 years ago (2 children)

You criticize Hexbear for dunks, but also criticize them for responding at length with citations.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 years ago

parentiquote.txt

Death to America

[–] [email protected] 8 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Wait I didn't mean to criticize citations I love citations mb.

What did I say I'll edit it

[–] [email protected] 21 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Hexbear comes here to be the debate bros they try so hard to dunk on.

What sort of behavior are you critiquing here?

Personally I think "debate bro" stuff is more arguing for the sake of arguing/bending over backwards to defend even trivial or weak points, maybe with a sprinkling of going back-and-forth long after it becomes clear you're at an impasse. I don't see a lot of that here anyway.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

It involves a wide variety of behaviors, including the stuff you said, but primarily the first thing that comes to mind for me is the behaviour of trying to force/coerce people to engage in debates/discussions that they don't want to have or are otherwise unprepared to have, usually on the bad-faith preposition that anyone who is unwilling to participate in said debate/discussion must only be unwilling for the reason of being wrong.

[–] [email protected] 24 points 2 years ago (4 children)

debates/discussions that they don't want to have or are otherwise unprepared to have

I see your point, but I think this is seriously undermined when you have someone like OP who is willing to post all day about this, and occasionally willing to dip their toes into trying to raise real points, but then throws up their hands and says "hey it's just a ~~joke~~ meme" whenever they're in a tough spot.

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Straight up misgendering half the posters lol

[–] [email protected] 17 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Please don't. I take that seriously and it is obtuse to pretend you don't know the phrase "debate bro". It was a cultural reference, and I have no intention at any point of misgendering anyone.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Use debate nerd instead in cases where you don't want to gender people.

[–] [email protected] 27 points 2 years ago

Debate pervert is also great

[–] db0 7 points 2 years ago

"debatenerd" I'm picking this up! But in my defense, I was saying "debate me bro", as in, someone who says "debate me, bro"

[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 years ago (1 children)

So, there is this cool thing you can do called making memes gender neutral instead of calling trans women bros.

Since you take misgendering extremely seriously, I thought you should know about this neat trick.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

This is a meme I am referencing after seeing it on hexbear. Specifically imitating their language to make a point. Maybe we should talk to them about it too. I obviously hadn't considered the full implications, and will not use that phrase anymore, for sure.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

You may also have seen "debatelord"

[–] [email protected] 5 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I don't remember seeing that specifically, I might have, but I did specifically see the other several times.

[–] [email protected] 19 points 2 years ago

I tend to use the term "debate pervert"

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[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 years ago (1 children)

broooo come on I thought we were cool

[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I'm not trying to make enemies, or say hexbear is as bad as people make it out to be

This thread is just no good

[–] [email protected] 12 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I mean communists are not well known for agreeing on things and not arguing about stuff.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I'm not saying I think this is the end of leftism as we know it or anything. I'm just appreciating the bar fight I guess.

It hasn't been a friendly thread.

[–] [email protected] 21 points 2 years ago (1 children)

If OP had the tiniest scrap of good faith in their being, things would have gone differently

[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I mean they just shared a meme from an instance you aren't federated with and quickly had like 20 people trying to demand complex conversations about history with them.

A lot of the complaints directed at them would be better served directed at whoever made the meme.

[–] [email protected] 23 points 2 years ago (17 children)

Maybe don't share history memes you don't even remotely understand that vilify people whose perspective you don't remotely understand? Dude has received some real softball questions and whiffed.

But OP doesn't give a shit, his ideology is "Dae tabkies bad" and the actual historical claims are secondary.

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[–] bigboig 10 points 2 years ago

They're starving, man