this post was submitted on 18 Oct 2023
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Science Memes

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[–] [email protected] 239 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (80 children)

Fyi, there's a lot of ~~woo woo~~ (edit: apparently racist term) crap out there that tries to make you believe that somehow the photons can feel that a human is watching them and they choose to behave differently as a result. This is not true. It just means that when you use a detector or some sort of probe that physically interacts with the photons they change their behavior. It's not magic.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 years ago (11 children)

There's actually no way to prove or disprove consciousness collapse theories, as even if an unmonitored detector causes collapse, you only know about it when a consciousness is reviewing the data. So at best it can be said that direct consciousness collapse theories aren't true, but AFAIK the ones still around are all indirect (i.e. collapse occurs at the point you are reviewing the data).

We could similarly talk about the "woo woo" of multiverse theories and how there's no proof for Everett's interpretation (despite being one of the few popular theories not to need an invalidation of an assumption in the Frauchiger-Renner paradox).

But no proof doesn't equal "not true."

All QM interpretations are up in the air, and an appeal to Copenhagen interpretation is probably one of the most nonsensical given a specific interpretation doesn't even exist for that one and it's effectively just become euphemistic for "shut up and calculate."

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Yeah it tends to be difficult to disprove fantasy when its proponents don't care about evidence.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Right, Roger Penrose and Eugene Wigner and a host of other physicists who subscribe/d to consciousness collapse interpretations aren't people who care about evidence...

It's wild how many people are so quick to be confidently incorrect about something that sounds correct and science-ish but doesn't at all reflect the actual subspecialty nuances.

Literally none of the QM interpretations have evidence supporting their particular interpretation.

At best there's a handful that have been abandoned due to falsification, like interpretations predicated on local hidden variables.

There's no more evidence for Copenhagen or many worlds than there is for consciousness collapse.

There's simply different inherent assumptions that different physicists are willing to entertain, but it's entirely a personal choice and ultimately not evidence driven.

And the picture of assumptions changes over time. For example, post-2018 all popular interpretations other than many worlds have a new "pick at least one of three" assumptions that must be embraced following a new paradox. But currently that's pretty much the only guiding factor, is what assumptions one is willing to entertain.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Sure thing, go ahead and pretend conscious collapse theories hold any ground in modern day physics.

They don't. But you keep believing the religion-eske fantasy that you're a special being who magically influences things.

It's crackpot, particularly your flavor claiming retroactive consciousness collapse 🤣

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