this post was submitted on 09 Oct 2023
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Antinatalist here - the rhetoric in that post is horrible, and is not representative of antinatalism as a whole.
Antinatalism isn’t the belief that a certain group shouldn’t reproduce - it’s that nobody should. The world is fucked, and nonconsensually bringing anyone into it is morally reprehensible. It’s not eugenics, it’s voluntary extinctionism.
For the people that have been born, however, everyone deserves respect and equity. Ableism, or any other kind of discrimination, is just wrong, and makes you a shitty person. Just like the person who made that post.
"Don't worry guys, that person doesn't represent us - what they should have said is that they wish for all of humanity to die out."
This is an absolutely insane thing to advocate for. I hope you come to realize that in time.
I’m not saying we should kill people, I’m saying making more is wrong.
It is a nonconsensual act whereupon you are forcing life and all its travesty onto another being, when they were perfectly fine not existing.
Call me insane if you want, I couldn’t care less. Humans are a plague upon both other humans and this planet as a whole, and bringing someone else into the world to be both a victim and perpetrator of the issue is wrong.
I think your perspective about life is blinded by pessimism, and you're treating that pessimism as absolute fact. Many people view life as a wonderful thing, are thrilled to exist for the time that they do, and see creating a new life to experience the wonders of living as a gift.
You're sounding like Agent Smith from the matrix. Come on. Unplug from the negative feedback loop for a bit.
You call it pessimism, I call it realism.
There are good things to experience, yes. If you’re already alive, then by all means, seek to find happiness and enjoyment. Don’t force someone else into that endless struggle. You can make no guarantees that their life won’t be one of pure suffering, and that’s not a risk I’m willing to take.
And again, we are destroying this planet - not just for us, but for all life on it. We are the problem.
Says every person with depression ever.
I agree with the other commenter recommending therapy. When you don't see it as "life is pain and the future is hopeless", you might sound less like a scifi villain calling for human extinction.
“Existence is suffering” is a foundational tenet for many worldviews and religions, not just antinatalism. Existence is literally the first cause to all suffering - no existence, no suffering.
Acknowledging that doesn’t make me depressed or pessimistic, it’s just acceptance how things are.
You’re free to live in whatever fantasy you want, though. That’s your right.
Also, responding to differing worldviews with “get help” is generally bad form
Without any sort of guarantee.
It’s a gamble. Literally gambling with human lives.
If one never exists, they face neither pleasure nor pain. If one is forced to exist - remember, this is never consensual - then one may experience pleasure and pain, and simply hope that pleasure is more bountiful. Hopes, dreams, goals, ideas that may or may not be met. All of it essentially left to chance. Will their life be pleasurable? Possibly. Will life be painful? Certainly. Suffering is guaranteed. Pleasure is not. Are we to keep forcing others to play, simply in the hope that things work out well for them?
No. I don’t gamble with lives. Nor should anyone.
Your worldview is literally calling for the extinction of all humans. You need to come back to reality and stop convincing yourself that this is normal or healthy.
Yes, it is. And I’m just fine, I prefer not to live in idealistic delusion
Maybe educate yourself on the actual philosophy
Ah, yes the classic "everyone else who doesn't subscribe is deluded" echochamber red flag.
"Voluntary Extinction" is right up there with "flat earthers" and "anti-vax" as the dumbest pseudo-intellectual things I've read on the internet.
Ignorance is bliss, I suppose.
Enjoy your dreamland, and have a nice day
Just know that you don’t have to feel this way. Depression is a sickness that convinces you “that’s just the way it is”. It’s a chemical disfunction of the brain. It can be treated most of the time. It’s a hard path, starting with finding the right therapist, but it’s worth a try. Talking as someone who’s life was saved by therapy.
The fact that you’re equating antinatalism to depression tells me you really don’t understand what you’re talking about.
If you knew and understood what actually goes on in this world, you would be "depressed" regardless of the chemicals in your brain working or not. All the happy pills in the world, and trust me from experience, all the best drugs in the world, would not get rid of genocide, fascism, or a world built upon capitalism, that at its very core is based upon exploitation, subjugation, and oppression of half of the world, and the mass destruction of most of the Earth's species and the planet itself to fuel the greed and sole benefit of the worlds greatest sociopaths, wherein you happen to be one of the few lucky ones who can live in a tiny bubble where you are completely unaware of the extent of mass suffering and death that is occurring in the neighborhoods you don't go to and the countries that are too far away for you to care about. If you read through the publicly available documents of what the CIA in the US did in the 20th century alone, you would not think coming to the conclusion that humans as a species are irredeemable could only be the result of a disfunctioning brain. I'm not even an antinatalist, I'm just autistic and study a lot of history.
Why stop at humans? Ducks are pretty reprehensible as well.
And the less said about koalas, the better.
Irrelevant.
Humans are the primary cause for global suffering. Ducks are pretty fucked tho, they could probably go as well.
Mosquitoes I shouldn’t even have to mention. I think we can all agree those fuckers need to go
This is an incredibly dumb idea. It will also die out for incredibly obvious reasons because everyone else will keep reproducing while antinatalists descend into irrelevancy.
Genesis 1:28 and al-Baqarah 2:187 instruct reproduction. Antinatalists are destined for the fire.
Wow, the Church of Shar exists in the real world.
I think your belief system is a rare example actual Evil. You're literally advocating for the elimination of music, of art, of science, of anyone who could even appreciate those things. No more Rembrandt or Dali or Mozart or ... anything. And you've gotten so twisted up inside, ostensibly because some people live sad, hard lives, that you think that's a good thing.
Dude, find a therapist. This is no way to live.
Brother if you think advocating for less population is "actual Evil" you're in for a real hard time out in the world.
I’m advocating for the elimination of poverty, disease, death, pollution, war, hate, and all human suffering.
Sure, there are some neat things in this world that are worth experiencing if you were forced to live. If you’re already alive, of course you should seek to find happiness and enjoyment in the little time you have.
Still doesn’t justify forcing more people into the world to exacerbate the problems we have - overpopulation being a major one.
It’s not evil. Things were fine before us, and things will be fine after us.
Antinatalism is evil because it goes against what God instructed.
"Things" were not observable by anything with the capability to designate them as such, so no they were not "fine" in any meaningful sense of the word.
You're literally doing the speech the villain does to make him seem reasonable.
I am literally begging you to find a therapist.
Semantics, but if you really want to get into it, a lack of ability for things to be good or bad is still better than the existence and perpetuation of suffering.
Also, responding to differing worldviews with “see a therapist” and comparing them to a villain is fucking disgusting
Arguing that people must exist so as to maintain art and science is rather silly. Art and science exist for our utility; we are under no obligation to them. If people decide not to reproduce, that is their right.
Isn't it just the belief that nobody should have kids though? I'd have thought the while extinction part would rank higher than the culture loss. And evil seems a bit extreme, sounds more like apathy and loss of hope to me. Not saying there aren't some messed up people in the group though.